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Lance Armstrong 9, Obama 4, Chris Christie 4, France 3, Marie Callender 3, Advair 3, Msnbc 2, Nissan Sentra 2, United 2, Us 2, New Jersey 2, Romney 2, Lance 2, Ford 1, J.j. Ram Burg 1, Paul 1, Washington 1, Copd 1, Corolla 1, The Navy 1,
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  MSNBC    Hardball Weekend    News/Business. The best of  
   'Hardball With Chris Matthews.'  

    January 20, 2013
    4:00 - 4:29am PST  

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are going to see each other or be in the same room together again. >> mr. hall, i don't know what happens once you go behind that door, i think you do. you've been to the penitentiary. i agree that it's a wholly unpleasant place to be. my hope for you, and it is for everybody in your situation, is that you take advantage of whatever opportunities are there for you. and that, at some point, you develop a sense of empathy for what you've done to these people. not just to mr. bishop, but to his family. and the curse of that is that you will feel the horror of that. but the blessing of that is that that will allow you to change. good luck with what happens next. thank you all.
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hey, lance, tell us something we don't know. let's play "hardball." >> good evening. i'm michael. in tonight for chris mathews. let's start with this. lance slide. it's not like we didn't see this coming for a long time. lance armstrong's cheating and deceptions have been chronicled, reported and testified for years. lance armstrong was no ordinary cheat, no fourth outfielder or linebacker hoping for extra muscle. lance armstrong was an
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international hero, a seven-time tour de france, winner, the babe ruth, mohammad ali, the usain bolt of his sport. not to mention a public face in the fight against cancer. yet in his confessional last night with oprah, he confessed only what was obvious to anyone who wanted to see it, that he doped throughout his cycling career. but armstrong did not admit to cheating, denied he was a doping ringleader, didn't admit to bullying and worst of all, seemed emotionally incapable of sympathy for ts people whose lives he ruined and money he took when they tried to do nothing more than tell the truth about what he had done. joining me is "the daily beast's" buzz bissinger and sports editor for "the nation" dave zirin. buzz, i have to bring it up, in august of 2012, just five months ago, you wrote a cover story for "newsweek" entitled "i still believe in lance armstrong," and yet last night armstrong's interview with oprah winfrey began with a series of yes, and no questions. >> did you ever take banned substances to enhance your cycling performance?
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>> yes. >> yes or no, was one of those banned substances epo? >> yes. >> did you ever blood dope or use blood transfusions to enhance your cycling performance? >> yes. >> did you ever use any other banned substances like testosterone, cortisone, or human growth hormone? >> yes. >> yes or no, in all seven of your tour de france victories, did you ever take banned substances or blood dope? >> yes. >> buzz, you are a pulitzer prize winner, you're a smart guy, friend of mine. how was he able to roll you so recently as a couple months ago? >> well, you know, i cringe when i see that cover, and i say that honestly. i think he was able to roll me because i did not do my due diligence, and i think he aided and abetted just slightly because i spoke to him before i did the story. this was in august.
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he said he was giving up the fight against usada, but he still seemed defiant. he said the odds were stacked against me. these guys were out to screw me. i was denied due process. there was never a hint, even a subtle off-the-record hint, that something was amiss and there really was a reason behind his wanting to give up the fight. so i bought it. i said i still believe in lance, i still felt he was a hero despite the blood doping. i assumed he did it, but because of the foundation and overcoming cancer and just 2%, 3%, 5%, he really shot my credibility. >> in retrospect, do you think he should have reined you in, that he owed it to you knowing you were going to come forth with that kind of defense to say hey man, maybe you shouldn't get out there so far? >> you know, i do. and i do, but at the end of the day, i'm not going to blame him. i'm going to blame myself. but, look, he's lance armstrong. what he wanted was the cover of "newsweek." he wanted a prominent -- someone
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prominent in the world of sports to come to his defense because as we all saw last night, lance is a clinical, classic narcissist who really only cares about himself. so he didn't care about me. he cared about getting what he could out of me, but, you know, journalists go through this all the time, and i bought it, and i'm embarrassed. >> dave, you wrote that what he's trying to do now is the equivalent of riding a bike through the eye of a needle. well, we watched half of it. we'll see the rest of it tonight perhaps. did he succeed? >> no, he didn't succeed at all, and he didn't succeed on either front, and that's the key point here is that he had to do two different things that were very different, very divergent, and he failed at both. this is what he had to do. first, he had to show the united states anti-doping agency that he was contrite, that he was serious about taking their findings as the new law of the land. that their findings about him were correct. he had to show he was serious
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about that, and if he did that, maybe they would lift the lifetime ban they had imposed upon him. the second thing he had to do was build public sympathy. maybe try to remind people why they fell in love with lance armstrong in the first place. on the first front, failed miserably. he actually drew a line through the heart of the usada report. the heart of the report said that lance armstrong was actually a doping ringleader, that he wasn't just another cyclist who used peds, but that he organized his team to actually use dope. >> he wasn't accepting of that last night. >> no. he said absolutely not. and usada today, they are not happy with that interview. on the second front about building public sympathy, i mean, my word, i felt like i was watching the titanic hit an iceberg. i felt like oprah kept trying to help him, like throwing him lifelines, like try to make yourself more sympathetic, please. all he could do is stare back with this reptilian look on his face and really have no sense of regard for anybody but himself. the only thing that came across was i'm really, really sorry i got caught. >> let's take a look at
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something else. armstrong told oprah when he was doping he had a clear conscience. listen to this. >> was it a big deal to you? did it feel wrong? >> at the time? >> uh-huh. >> no. >> it did not even feel wrong? >> no. it's scary. >> did you feel bad about it? >> no. even scarier. >> did you feel in any way that you were cheating? >> no. the scariest. >> buzz, i took that to mean that he thought he was doing this rationalizing to keep pace with everybody else. you know, everybody was doing this, and this is the way -- the only way he could stay competitive. >> well, you know, that's what i thought as well, but i think dave makes a really good point. to me i changed my position not because of pressure from readers, although many said,
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buzz, you have the wool over your eyes. i changed my position when the actual report came out in october and, as dave said, the worst thing about those allegations was that he coerced teammates, that he was a ringleader, that it was the most sophisticated system they had ever seen of evading detection by drugs. that took it to a whole different level. and during the interview he denied basically all of that. and i also think what happened is usada said the first step is you're going to have to confess. he didn't want to do this, and i think they were floating a trial balloon and saying let's see how it plays with the public. can we afford to give him redemption, and it played terribly with the public. >> do you want a piece of that? >> yes. you know what he did that was really repellent that i don't think the media is remarking upon enough, but when he said, no, i did not lead a doping ring, what he was doing was accusing the people who are on his team of lying to usada. he was accusing them of perjury, accusing them of lying under
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oath. if last night was supposed to be lance armstrong comes clean, the lies are done, guess what? he either lied or accused people who were at his mercy when they basically worked for him with his team for the tour de france, he accused them of a federal crime. >> thank you, buzz and dave. we appreciate it very much. coming up, lance armstrong isn't the only athlete who has explaining to do. more and more people are wondering exactly what notre dame's manti te'o knew and when he knew it about the tragic death of a girlfriend that never existed and from a disease he never had. the longer he says silent people suspect he has something to hide. senator ted cruz is exploiting the murder of children to strengthen gun laws and a few steps to the right are the truthers who claim the sandy hook shootings were engineered by the government to gain sympathy for gun laws. in this atmosphere, how much can the obama administration really get done on gun safety? also, as president obama prepares for a second term,
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which way is the democratic party headed? will it be a pragmatic middle of the road alternative to the gop or will they try to seize the moment and move sharply to the left? you can't be president of the united states for four more years without a couple of episodes like this. >> we cannot sustain -- oops. was that my -- that's all right. all of you know who i am. >> we'll have more of the lighter moments of the first term in the side show. this is "hardball," the place for politics. y,when it can be f? push-ups or sprints? what's wrong with fetch? or chase? let's do this larry! ooh, i got it, i got it! (narrator) the calorie-smart nutrition in beneful healthy weight... includes grains and real chicken, because a healthy dog is a playful dog. beneful healthy weight. find us on facebook to help put more play in your day.
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welcome back to "hardball." one of president obama's first major challenges in the second term will be trying to get significant new gun control legislation through the congress. but can he do it? if allowed in the "times" outrageous opposition coming from the right is any indication the president has one major fight on his hands, the nra
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labeled him a hip toe p po krits and called out his daughters who receive secret service protection. yesterday senator ted cruz accused the president of exploiting the murder of children to push through gun control legislation and then there are the real nuts out there. a movement of people who say that the sandy hook tragedy was a hoax. the real purpose was to create a political environment to take away all our guns. the opposition is intense, the american public is largely on board with at least some of the president's agenda. in a new nbc news/"wall street journal" poll, more than half, 56%, say laws covering the sale of firearms should be stricter. so what realistically can the president do? david corn is washington bureau chief for "mother jones," joy reid is managing editor of thegrio.com, and both are msnbc political analysts. joy, how large should he be looking? >> i think the president needs to go in with a large package obviously, but when you talk to individual lawmakers, particularly on the house side, you get the sense two things have to happen. first of all, something has to pass the senate.
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that theoretically could be large, but the house is going to be a much tougher sled, although i was speaking with a couple lawmakers yesterday who seemed to think parts of what the president wants could actually pass in the house. things that are pretty much noncontroversial, things like universal background checks that even pro-gun, even pro-nra people support, and there is a possibility you could get high capacity magazines through the house, but whatever happens, it seems like the senate will -- have to act. >> i hope we get votes. one of the things i was offended by in the simpson/bowles process was people at home never knew how their house or senate felt, because they didn't have clean up and down votes. i think we're owed that. >> in the not so bad world, you're correct. we should have votes up and down on this. i think right now the people who are the obstructionists, the republicans, the gun lobby, are talking more reasonably than they will a month or two or three down the road when some of these things come up for possible votes. more important than deciding to
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have a big package, do a series of votes, the only way this will succeed is if the president can keep up the intensity level on his side, on the side of those people who want to see these things passed. we know that the gun lobby and the gun fanatics will be very intense not just tomorrow but six months from now and a year from now, and to overcome that opposition, which will manifest itself when the moment comes, he's going to have to keep cops engaged, educators, neighbor groups, public educators and public safety advocates, really as engaged in this issue as the nra, and that's a challenge. >> they might continue to shoot themselves in the foot, pun intended. i want to show a little bit of this. earlier this week, the nra released a web video that gets very personal with the president. take a look. >> are the president's kids more important than yours? then why is he skeptical about putting armed security in our schools when his kids are protected by armed guards at their school?
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>> one of the few republicans to call the nra out for that video was governor chris christie. take a look at what he said in a press conference just yesterday. >> to talk about the president's children or any public officer's children who have not by their own choice but by requirement to have protection and to use that somehow to try to make a political point i think is reprehensible. i think it's awful to bring public figures' children into the political debate. they don't deserve to be there, and i think for any of us who are public figures, you see that kind of ad and you cringe. >> chris christie i think is on the right side of this politically speaking for himself at home in new jersey. why aren't more republicans -- he's the only one i'm aware of who took this position. >> absolutely. chris christie once again -- first of all, he's consistent because he's yelled at people for asking about his own kids being private schooled, if you remember that youtube moment. but he's also one of the only
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republicans who doesn't seem beholden to the far right. i think that's part because he's doing politics in new jersey, which is essentially a blue state where he wants to get re-elected governor. i think he's ensuring he will get re-elected governor, but this is one of the reasons i can't see chris christie being anywhere near being the nominee for the republican party for president. >> i think he's running for president but as the democratic nominee. >> he will never make it through the republican primary. >> viewers of msnbc, if they've watched the shows the past few days, know i have kept asking for any republican in an elected leadership position to say something about the craziness and excessive rhetoric on their side, and colin powell, i'm sorry, he doesn't count as a republican anymore. but chris christie, i will give him credit, he finally stepped up and said at least this nra ad is bad. but what about the guys calling for civil war, impeachment, attacking the president for being a king, imperial, rand paul. it's amazing the free run they're getting from the more responsible people, if they even exist, in the republican party. >> what's amazing to me is the
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president in his remarks with the vice president embraced the second amendment, made reference to the creator, invoked the name of ronald reagan, and still comes out of the thing as a socialist who -- >> a secret muslim socialist who wants to take your guns. >> perhaps the most disturbing trend since the newtown shootings has been the rise of conspiracy theorists who claim the whole thing was a hoax, part of an elaborate plan by the government to provoke enough anger to warrant rounding up your guns. websites, blogs, youtube videos have attacked the veracity of officials and official accounts of tragedy. they allege many of the people interviewed on tv were actually actors. that the parents didn't show enough emotion and therefore must be in on the conspiracy. some claim if the shooting actually happened, there must have been more than one shooter and the government was involved somehow. one 30-minute truther video on youtube has been viewed over 10 million times, and it's not just the loons on the internet. james tracy is a tenured professor at florida atlantic university. take a look at what he wrote on his blog.
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while it sounds like an outrageous claim, one is left to inquire whether the sandy hook shooting ever took place, at least in the way law enforcement authorities and the nation's news media have described. david corn, i remember growing up and going to the movies and paying because i wanted to learn whether big foot really existed. >> yes. >> and somehow now in the 21st century, you know, those sort of nutty ideas where nobody got hurt have morphed into this sort of loose change-like garbage if you remember in the aftermath of september 11. >> i hate to say it, but this was predictable. you knew the alex joneses and other people in the world would use this for their own ends to sell books, to sell theories. i mean, like the pfesser's statement is one of the best arguments against tenure i've ever heard. it's too bad we feel compelled to debunk this. it's craziness that goes beyond the gun fanatic craziness. >> right. i mean i think there's a part of the human psyche that doesn't really want to believe that really bad things happens and
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the occam's razor applies to them. when something horrific happens, people look for a bigger conspiracy. or when the president, when john f. kennedy was shot, people couldn't quite believe the narrative they were given was true. i think what's different, today there is a commerce in it. this same conspiracy that the government is going to grab your guns and use a false flag attack on american citizens to do it -- >> thank you. the lighter moments of president obama's first term. follow me on twitter if you can spell smerconish. this is "hardball," the place for politics. meet the five-passenger ford c-max hybrid. c-max says ha. c-max says wheeee. which is what you get, don't you see? cause c-max has lots more horsepower than prius v, a hybrid that c-max also bests in mpg. say hi to the all-new 47 combined mpg c-max hybrid.
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next time you tune into "hardball," we'll be a few hours into president obama's second term. embedded in all the highs and lows of the past four years have been those lighter moments that are equally tough to forget. let's take a quick look back.
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>> we cannot sustain -- oops. was that my -- that's all right. all of you know who i am. the guy forgot his keys. jimmied his way to get into the house. there was a report called into the police station that there might be a burglary taking place. so far so good, right? i mean, if i was trying to jigger -- well, i guess this is my house now, so it probably wouldn't happen, but let's say my old house in chicago. here i'd get shot. bipartisan outreach will be so successful that even john boehner will consider becoming a democrat. after all, we have a lot in common. he is a person of color. although not a color that appears in the natural world.
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leaders of the republican party, they call the passage of this bill armageddon. end of freedom as we know it. so after i sign the bill, i looked around to see if there were any asteroids falling or sudden cracks opening up in the earth. turned out it was a nice day. they said we needed to triple the border patrol. well, now they're going to say we need to quadruple the border patrol or they'll want a higher fence. maybe they will need a moat. maybe they want alligators in the moat. lots of ups, lots of downs, except for my approval ratings which have just gone down. but that's politics. it doesn't bother me. besides, i happen to know that my approval ratings are still very high in the country of my birth. he seems all-american, but if you heard his real middle name,
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tim hosni pawlenty, what a shame. governor romney has said that he hoped a similar version of this plan from last year would be introduced as a bill on day one of his presidency. he even called it marvelous, which is a word you don't often hear when it comes to describing a budget. it's a word you don't often hear generally. i think governor romney maybe hasn't spent enough time looking at how our military works. you mentioned the navy, for example. and that we have fewer ships than we did in 1916. well, governor, we also have fewer horses and bayonets. i particularly want to apologize to chris matthews. four years ago i gave him a thrill up his leg. this time around i gave him a stroke. >> there's no reason to think that we shouldn't expect more of
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those in the next term. this is the official portrait of president obama from four years ago. here is the new one. sure, he doesn't look quite as young, but clearly he opted to go a much more cheerful route this time around. that's "hardball" for now. coming up next "your business" with j.j. ram burg. so now i can be in the scene. advair is clinically proven to help significantly improve lung function. unlike most copd medications, advair contains both an anti-inflammatory and a long-acting bronchodilator working together to help improve your lung function all day. advair won't replace fast-acting inhalers for sudden symptoms and should not be used more than twice a day. people with copd taking advair may have a higher chance of pneumonia. advair may increase your risk of osteoporosis and some eye problems. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking advair.
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